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Recording Audio with a NT-1A in Ableton Suite 8
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| DjStephenWiley |
So I've decided I want to learn to record audio. Using a saffire pro 40 for the preamp and the NT-1A from Rode will be here tomorrow. It's the anniversary edition that just came out and includes a built in shock mount, pop filter, dust cover, and even a tutorial DVD.
Tips are highly appreciated here. It's obviously a very sensitive condenser mic, and so with that in mind I have the following wonders. As a heads up, this will be EXCLUSIVE to vocals. Nothing else.
24 bit or 16 bit? (I've read I can go dry on 24 bit which ultimately could be better but people I respect quite a bit have said 16 bit. Why?!)
Compression - None, a little, or a lot? I know this is a very variable thing here because every vocalist is different but what is your general approach here on a very sensitive mic? I personally want the softer parts to come alive and the loud parts to be under control but of course I want the dynamics to be there, but as we know you can't remove any FX from a recording so you could screw it all up. Oh, and there's 8239482098349 compressors out there. Any software compressors that really shine for vocals?
Gates - Of course going to use one. Any specific ones and where do you put yours in your chain? Do you use one or two? Keep in mind this is a very sensitive mic so I think a gate is important here.
EQ - Last on the chain I'm assuming? Not too concerned here as this will vary wildly.
Finally, what is a general chain you use for recording vocals?
Also, anything you want to add, point out, or advise?
Thank you xXxXoxOxoxXOXOxoxOxxXOxoXoXOXOxO:clown: |
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| lcrqq |
Nice you decided on the NT1A :D I think you will be happy with it.
With 24 bit recording you have more digital headroom. What that means is you don't need to record as hot of a signal as you would be with 16 bit -- your signal to noise ratio is better with 24 bit. When I record vocals or do any recording in that sense, I use 88.2KHz / 24 bit, that way when you downsample to 44.1 for CD quality it's easier math than 48K or 96K. In general it's better to record at a higher sample rate/bit depth (of course the downside being it takes up more space on your HD).
For compression, I usually like to run vocals through a hardware compressor (I have access to high quality compressors such as LA2A's and such :D) with a low ratio setting while recording to Pro-Tools/Logic/whatever. This just seems to give the vocals some character and makes everything a bit "smoother".
9 times out of 10 you will use compression on the vocals at some point during mixing to get it to sit well in the mix. In your case, without a hardware compressor, it might be better to just record the vocalist dry, then in mixdown, apply the compression until it sounds good.
There are some very good plug in compressors for vocals. My favorite, once again, being the UAD version of the LA2A. It is a VERY simple compressor to use, just two variables peak reduction and gain. I believe there are a few emulations of it from waves and a few other software companies but TBH I don't know of any freeware software plugins to use on vocals. I am sure you can find one that sounds good!
Gates - I personally wouldn't use one in my vocal chain but during mixing it might be a good idea. I usually just strip silence vocals instead of gating them just because of DSP issues. If you were going to use one, I would use it before the compressor in your chain because compressors bring up the noise floor in the recording and since gates are triggered off the loudness of the signal, an uncompressed signal would be easier for the gate to know if there is a signal or not.
EQ - all depends on your vocalist. Male/Female vocals? I personally always use a high pass filter in my chain around 100Hz to get rid of useless rumble in the signal. Since you are using a condenser, it is going to pick up some inaudible low end rumble that is useless and takes up headroom. For any other EQing it all depends on the vocalist themselves -- EQ it until it sounds good :p
My chain for recording vocals in the studio I work at is Mic->neve 1073 pre ->LA2A->pro-tools... when I'm at my home workstation its mic->apogee ensemble pre->logic eq with low cut->compressor and then sends to reverbs/delays and what not. Pretty simple but it works :P
Hope this helps
-Nick |
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| DjStephenWiley |
helps a lot. got another recommended general chain going with a gate first followed by a tube at +3 to 4dB along with some modest compression and finally topped with some light EQ. I was told to configure the gate to where there is no hissing when no vocals are being recorded and to use the pads on my preamp for additional headroom. This person said to use 44.1 and 16bit though and you are saying to use something quite different. I understand what the higher things offer. Without head drive space a factor, is there any reason to record in 44.1/16bit when higher qualities are available?
i plan to use the plugs in ableton for now until i learn more. im just hoping my saffire pro preamp and this mic is going to be good enough to record some good stuff |
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| lcrqq |
I wouldn't use PADs for recording vocals.. I mean the only time I use PADs is when recording some high level source, such as a kick drum or guitar cab but whatever works is cool :P.
The reason I run my sessions at a higher sample rate is because it's more accurate when mixing and, like I said before, you have more headroom when you are recording. It's fine to record at 44.1/16 since it's going to get downsampled to that anyways when you put it on a CD, but it is always nice to have an 88.2/24 bit recording since it's twice the quality of a CD :) |
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| cryophonik |
I think Nick (lcrqq) summed up everything just about perfectly, so let me just add a few nuggets. Whatever effects you use while tracking, go easy on them because you can't undo a printed effect. You'll have plenty of opportunity to post-process the vocals to your liking. There's nothing worse than having the singer nail that high note perfectly in the chorus, only to discover that the compressor audibly clamped down on it, ruining what would've been the perfect take (yes, I'm speaking from experience). Also, gates aren't necessary when recording and you run the risk of the gate not opening or closing properly, ruining a take. It's much easier to gate/expand (or, use a gain envelope) to reduce/eliminate background noise after the fact IMO.
I absolutely concur with Nick that 88.2KHz/24 bit is the way to go - start with high quality and most headroom, because you'll only be degrading it as you go through the mixdown process. The only good reason for using 16-bit that I can think of is to reduce file size.
Reverb - as Nick alluded to, your singer will very likely want to hear some reverb while tracking to make it sound more natural. Set it up as a send effect on a bus so you can feed some back into the headphones (i.e., for monitoring only) without printing the effect.
Try to maintain a high signal:noise ratio by recording in a quiet environment, keeping the singer at an appropriate distance from the mic (too close will result in a proximity effect), etc. A trained singer will probably already have good mic technique, but a less experienced singer may need some coaching. |
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| 3F05Q |
On the mic side of things...
Room treatment and ambient noises should be addressed first. Just like room treatment for monitoring, your microphone hears the room as well. You may be more tempted to turn down your recording level and stand much closer to the mic, but then you'll get proximity effect which will increase the low-end of your recording. (unless you want that, of course) Just a heads up, if you didn't already know that stuff.
Register your mic to make sure you have the ten-year warranty. I doubt you'll have to take advantage of it, but it's nice to have. When not in use, store it with the moisture packet. The user's manual has good info on this. Pin-1 is longer by design, no it's not a defect, the XLR will plug in fine. If you do need to take advantage of service, a call is preferred over e-mail... just saying. :P
Looking forward to what you come up with! |
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| DjStephenWiley |
Thanks for the tips. I thought I had a picture taken but apparently my camera decided it didn't want to save them? I'm going to take some more in a minute. The microphone is facing about 10x12 of open space, so I've got quite an open background to the mic. One thing I have noticed is that it is not nearly as sensitive as I expected it to be (which is a good thing) - A friend said it could hear a fly fart, and while it would probably could with some crazy preamp, I can't even pick up my PC fan with my current set up. Hopefully I'm not doing anything wrong?
All pads and dB cutters are turned off. I'm having to run the channel at about 85% to get an RMS of 16 at 12" - At 6" it gets much louder and then of course gets quite loud the closer I get. Right now I'm just tracking it in Ableton through input 1. Anybody here have any suggestions for really good stereo imaging of vocals (post processing of course, just in certain situations) Any other neat configurations with reverbs and things of the sort would be appreciated too. One board member told me to create an awesome stereo image in Ableton to do the following:
Ping Pong Delay
turn off sync
8.4 or 16.8sh ms
100% wet
100% filter open
There's a million ways to skin a cat though and I'm all about learning if somebody is willing to teach. |
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| RichieV |
| since you are making EDM , i would use the eq before the compressor. I think the biggest thing is just getting a good sound in which like the guy above said room treatment which there doesn't seem to be any and a good singer. |
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| DjStephenWiley |
Yea. Just another thing I'm trying to learn. Been reading about it and asking a ton of questions. Those of you on my AIM are probably tired of me :d
I am a micro-manager and I want to be able to do everything (within reason) from the comfort of my home own. I'm patient too though so learning and trial + error do not bother me. I've found over the last year producing that things are often "taught to an extreme" if that makes any sense.
What I mean by that is, sometimes I read things on here that are quite irrelevant to the topic at hand and EDM in general. Posts can go to the extreme as if you were about to write a tune for James Horner's new score and it becomes very confusing to people who can't differentiate these things. Took me a while to learn this, and there are "frequent offenders" that I see doing it that I try to take with a grain of salt. (I'm not saying it's wrong, but I just personally feel like it's information overload regarding the topic at hand. Think of that bing commercial where people start talking crazy because of their search engine) - The knowledge is great, and I'm sure it helps some more than others, but I know when I first started posting here I was very confused for a while and once I started actually digging my sleeves up and getting things done myself I started to discover what is nonsense jibber jabber and what isn't. |
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